Ottawa Senators acquire Andy Sutton from NYI
by DarrenM on Mar 2, 2010 1:43 PM EST
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PrintDefenseman Andy Sutton has been traded to the Ottawa Senators for a second-round pick (San Jose's pick that was received in the Heatley deal). Full analysis below:
Pros:
- Ottawa badly needed some defensive help for the playoff run, and they got it without losing any roster players.
- As you can see from what has been provided, Andy Sutton is a hulking defensive defenseman (6'6"! 245lbs!). He leads his team by a huge margin in blocked shots (153) and hits (155). In case you're curious, that's more blocked shots and hits than Anton Volchenkov. He's second in blocked shots to only Dennis Seidenberg. Yeah, this guy is a warrior.
- He averages over 20 minutes of time on ice per game.
- If you compile his last four years, he has an even plus/minus, despite playing on the Atlanta Thrashers and New York Islanders during that span. Not bad.
- New York Islanders fans seem to think that they did not get nearly enough for Sutton, which makes me feel good inside.
Cons:
- The Ottawa Senators have now burned two second round draft picks on UFAs (Matt Cullen being the other one). It's a fairly high price for Sutton, and it's bad news for a team that is already lacking in surefire prospects. It's even worse news for the AHL's Binghamton Senators who continue to struggle.
- Ottawa already has Matt Carkner, Chris Phillips, and Volchenkov as stay-at-home defensemen, and may have been better off with a more versatile player.
- Sutton is not very quick on his feet, which can be dangerous in the playoffs.
- The last time the Ottawa Senators grabbed a defenseman from the New York Islanders at the deadline, it was Chris Campoli.
Overall:
Sutton will make the Ottawa Senators hard to play against in the playoffs, and the Senators now have one of the most punishing blue-lines in the East, if not the league. Teams will fear coming into the Ottawa Senators' zone or getting anywhere near the goalies. Sutton's shot-blocking will also have positive effects on the other weak link of the Senators: goaltending. It also was likely the best defensive option for Murray to pick up without giving up too much at the deadline.
I'm still not convinced this was a great deal, but it was probably necessary for any sort of playoff run. My complaint is that the greatest strength of the Ottawa Senators organization under Murray seems to be drafting, but we've now lost two of our top three picks on rental players. Sure, they're second rounders, but that's where the Senators picked up much-heralded prospects like Robin Lehner and Patrick Wiercioch. Unless Murray restocks the cupboards by moving some players for picks (probably from our abundance of forwards), then he has definitely sacrificed a decent chunk of the future in order to make this playoff run. Then again, isn't that the Ottawa Senators way?
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I think I might be overjoyed at this
I hope it’s true!
Silver Seven - The Daniel Alfredsson of Ottawa Senators Blogs
Someone is reporting it's SJ's 2nd
I sure hope not, that would be a gross overpayment.
by GelatinousMutantCoconut on Mar 2, 2010 1:54 PM EST reply actions
Dreger and MacKenzie have confirmed it.
Sutton for Sj’s second round pick. Wow, that’s a lot to give up for a player that would be below Volchenkov and Carkner on the physical d-man depth chart. I was hoping we could acquire a more well-rounded D for the second, and get a Sutton/Ward for a 4th or lower.
by GelatinousMutantCoconut on Mar 2, 2010 1:58 PM EST up reply actions
His hits are like whoa?
Awesome synopsis.
by Peter Raaymakers on Mar 2, 2010 2:06 PM EST up reply actions
Grit and size... you know, the things Murray covets
Silver Seven - The Daniel Alfredsson of Ottawa Senators Blogs
So, essentially, a 2nd rounder is a prerequisite for acquiring anyone not terrible on defense
I wonder what the price for some of the better guys will be? Obviously it was too high for Murray.
Silver Seven - The Daniel Alfredsson of Ottawa Senators Blogs
Yeah, people are saying second rounders are basically what you need to start negotiating
I usually like to keep those picks, but this is a good acquisition. It should give us a good run, but the Senators will have to make sure their late-round picks pan out to off-set the trades.
by Peter Raaymakers on Mar 2, 2010 2:16 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, we had two seconds
Now we have none. I am unenthused about this. Who’s good from Frolunda this year?
Silver Seven - The Daniel Alfredsson of Ottawa Senators Blogs
I don't know, but hopefully we draft them all
by Peter Raaymakers on Mar 2, 2010 2:22 PM EST up reply actions
I'm happy with this deal
I’m not sure how this impacts our depth chart, though. Sutton was apparently the Isles’ best defenceman; does he go from there to our third pairing? If so, are we going to scratch Campoli for… well… forever?
Phillips-Volchenkov
Karlsson-Kuba
Sutton-Carkner
Lee (scratch)
Campoli (inj)
by Peter Raaymakers on Mar 2, 2010 2:09 PM EST reply actions
I think I would rather see him with Karlsson
I think this means we don’t have any one pairing that is going to have to play 24 minutes a night.
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I'd like him to go with Carkner
That way we have two pairings who are on the PK together, too. But I think you’re right, our defence is going to have a very equitable distribution of ice time.
by Peter Raaymakers on Mar 2, 2010 2:17 PM EST up reply actions
Really, as long as he's better than Lee/Campoli in the physical department, I don't care where he plays
That leaves Kuba and Karlsson as victims of the forecheck, though.
Silver Seven - The Daniel Alfredsson of Ottawa Senators Blogs
Agreed. Kuba and Karlsson can both move the puck
so I’d rather they play on two lines. Switch Sutton and Kuba maybe? Give Kuba a partner that checks and maybe he’ll see what it’s like to do that again.
I'm not crazy about Carkner and Karlsson pairing up, though
I guess they could mesh well — it’s not like Carkner sucks, he just always makes the safe play — but somehow I don’t see it.
Silver Seven - The Daniel Alfredsson of Ottawa Senators Blogs
If anything, I think it'd be Karlsson with Sutton
Then put Carkner and Kuba together. But it all depends where Sutton could fit in, really.
by Peter Raaymakers on Mar 2, 2010 2:30 PM EST up reply actions
Karlsson-Sutton is defintely the pairing I want
Silver Seven - The Daniel Alfredsson of Ottawa Senators Blogs
Oh, you meant if Kuba was paired with Carkner
Is Carkner a bigger hitter than Sutton? I don’t think so.
Anyway, you’re a gentlemen and a scholar and I couldn’t agree with you more.
Silver Seven - The Daniel Alfredsson of Ottawa Senators Blogs
Sorry, my first reply was agreeing with you
and suggesting a modification based on the lines Peter stated. In other words
Phillips-Volchenkov
Karlsson-Sutton
Kuba-Carkner
Sutton and Carkner might be too slow and one dimensional.
Would rather pair one up with Kuba and one with Karlsson to balance the risks those guys take.
Silver Seven: the Daniel Alfredsson of Ottawa Senators blogs.
That would be a frightening pair (in a bad way)
Sutton is most effective when paired with a mobile defenseman. His best periods here were when paired with Mark Streit (the Isles’ best D-man) or Jack Hillen (a smaller, mobile, smart guy). In that sort of pairing, Sutton’s size and reach actually works to cover quite a bit of ground rather than sticking out as some such S.S. Hal Gill.
FWIW, seems like a fine, fair, unremarkable trade from my vantage point.
Lighthouse Hockey: Under contract through 2021, knees and hips be damned.
Thanks for the scouting report!
It’ll take some time to see where he’s going to fit in, I think. He sounds like Chris Phillips, in some ways, but perhaps not quite as effective.
by Peter Raaymakers on Mar 2, 2010 4:12 PM EST up reply actions
Fair enough deal
The price is high, but the market dictates. If it helps to win a round, I’d say it’s worth it.
It’ll be a very late second round pick, no? (Can’t remember, does it depend on how well SJ does in the playoffs? Ahh, conflicting hopes: the better SJ does, the lower the pick, but the more success Heatley has… tough call).
Playoff advancement matters in seeding
but higher record at each round goes last, so not matter what SJ will have a very late pick
I guess this means tomorrow's deadline will be boring for Sens fans
Silver Seven: the Daniel Alfredsson of Ottawa Senators blogs.
Devils advocate
It could also mean that Volchenkov is dealt for a player and a pick
Silver Seven - The Daniel Alfredsson of Ottawa Senators Blogs
Insane
It would be insane to trade Volchenkov. If we’re going for it (as it seems Murray is), you take the risk of losing him as an UFA, especially when there seems to be positive signs he could sign an extension.
by Sens Fan In NYC on Mar 2, 2010 2:26 PM EST up reply actions
Oh, I agree
I think Volchenkov should be re-signed no matter what. But Sutton is a guy who blocks shots and hits hard… sounds like someone else, doesn’t it?
I’m not saying this will happen, I’m just saying it might set the table for something like that.
Silver Seven - The Daniel Alfredsson of Ottawa Senators Blogs
True
Does anyone know if Sutton can keep up speed-wise?
by Sens Fan In NYC on Mar 2, 2010 2:31 PM EST up reply actions
I doubt it
I think he’s more of a crush-in-the-corners, clear-the-front-of-the-net guy
Silver Seven - The Daniel Alfredsson of Ottawa Senators Blogs
I don't think he's very fast
Hopefully he’s not Hal Gill-type slow, but I don’t think he can keep up with Chris Phillips—let alone Karlsson or something. Still, if he can at least keep up, it’ll be good.
by Peter Raaymakers on Mar 2, 2010 2:45 PM EST up reply actions
I can't think of any scenario where he would need to join a rush
I’ll probably spazz out if he does
Silver Seven - The Daniel Alfredsson of Ottawa Senators Blogs
I think he’s more mobile than people give him credit for. His style definitely makes you think “oil tanker,” but he can actually pinch in down low and get back. That said, you don’t want him rushing, just being the safety and clearing bodies. His size and hip checks create a lot of implied coverage.
I’ll be interested to see how he fits Ottawa’s style, but considering he was effective for Scott Gordon, I don’t think his relative speed should hold him back.
Lighthouse Hockey: Under contract through 2021, knees and hips be damned.
Gah, Murray Always Pisses Me Off With His Trades!!!
Not that this is a bad pick-up. it’s the price that upsets me. A second rounder for a one-dimensional defenseman is just too much.
I was hoping we could do something like Campoli and that 2nd for Seidenberg and then a 4th for Sutton. that way we have depth in both offensive and defensive defensemen.
We’ve now traded a SJ’s first round pick in 2009 and 2nd round pick in 2010 for Campoli and Sutton.
But, what’s done is done.
I would prefer:
Phillips-Karlsson
Kuba-Volchenkov
Sutton-Carkner
by GelatinousMutantCoconut on Mar 2, 2010 2:30 PM EST reply actions
But then again...
It’s better than a second for Leopold.
by GelatinousMutantCoconut on Mar 2, 2010 2:31 PM EST up reply actions
It's just the cost
Leopold was a second, Grebeshkov was a second. The Panthers want more than a second for Seidenberg. I think it’s just a matter of knowing he needed to improve, and understanding that it might be higher than he’d like, but it’s still not outrageous.
by Peter Raaymakers on Mar 2, 2010 2:33 PM EST up reply actions
No, it's not outrageous.
But the prices of picks were skyrocketing, no one wanted to give them out. Now all of a sudden 3rd and 4th line forwards and 5th/6th defensemen are worth second round pick and any top 6 forward or top 4 defenseman is worth a first. Never underestimate the power of GM insanity.
by GelatinousMutantCoconut on Mar 2, 2010 2:37 PM EST up reply actions
It will be extremely interesting to see what teams wind up giving for guys like Kubina
I think it’s clear that Murray either won’t or can’t pay the asking price for the higher end defensemen. Considering that they’re most likely rentals anyway, I’m ok with that.
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The asking price is just too high
I’m not sure if Kubina will even move. If the asking price is a first-rounder plus, does anyone want to make that deal?
by Peter Raaymakers on Mar 2, 2010 2:46 PM EST up reply actions
GMs always get crazy this time of year
But to give up that much… you’d better be damn confident in your depth. That’s a really short list of teams.
Silver Seven - The Daniel Alfredsson of Ottawa Senators Blogs
The Campoli trade hurts
But it’s hard to blame Murray for seeking a puck-mover… he had none, and had no real way of knowing if Karlsson would be ready this year.
Plus, there’s no guarantees Murray is done trading yet, though it seems likely.
Silver Seven - The Daniel Alfredsson of Ottawa Senators Blogs
No it's only a bad trade in retrospect.
I’m just a fan of keeping draft picks.
by GelatinousMutantCoconut on Mar 2, 2010 2:47 PM EST up reply actions
Same here
I’d rather have the pick than Campoli, just based on Murray’s recent draft record.
Silver Seven - The Daniel Alfredsson of Ottawa Senators Blogs
Yes, exactly!
Prospects that were picked at or after the 26th spot in 2009:
Kyle Palmieri (26th overall) would be just another 3rd/4th line grinder.
Phillipe Paradis (27th overall) has power forward potential
Dylan Olsen (28th overall) has become the #1 prospect on an already deep Blackhawks system
Carter Ashton (29th overall) two-way forward ranked behind only Victor Hedman in Tampa Bay’s system.
Simon Despres (30th overall) A big mobile defensive defensman. Would’ve looked good with Cowen.
Mikko Koskinen (31st overall) HUGE goaltender
Landon Ferraro (32nd overall) good pedigree, fast tenacious forechecker. Good leader.
Ryan o’Reilly (33rd overall) Having an excellent season as an 18 year old rookie
Karl Klingberg (34th Overall) a hard-working excellent skater, forechecks well and is aggressive. Second only to Evander Kane in the Thrashers system
Chris Brown (36th overall) Another celebrity girlfriend in Ottawa! Wait…not the same Chris Brown…that’s probably a good thing.
by GelatinousMutantCoconut on Mar 2, 2010 3:13 PM EST up reply actions
I didn't, and still don't, mind the Campoli deal
You never know what you get with a draft pick, and Campoli seemed like he would be a very good puck-mover. It looks like he’s going to stick around next year, he’ll be cheap once again, and he’ll get a good chance to keep improving.
by Peter Raaymakers on Mar 2, 2010 2:47 PM EST up reply actions
Murray seems to be a better drafter than Muckler, though
That makes our picks more valuable
Silver Seven - The Daniel Alfredsson of Ottawa Senators Blogs
Zidlicky signs a three-year, $12M deal
Sounds a lot like the Kuba deal, just with a bit more money for a few more points.
by Peter Raaymakers on Mar 2, 2010 2:33 PM EST reply actions
Hard to be surprised at that, considering how good he looked during the Kumite
Silver Seven - The Daniel Alfredsson of Ottawa Senators Blogs
Don't let Darren hear you say that!
He loves Phillips’ helmet. And for good reason.
by Peter Raaymakers on Mar 2, 2010 4:14 PM EST up reply actions
I wear that helmet when I sleep
don’t want to get concussed falling off the bed!
Silver Seven: the Daniel Alfredsson of Ottawa Senators blogs.
Via Twitter:
Sutton: “I’m ecstatic, unbelievable opportunity, a dream come true….played with Ruutu, skated with Carkner in the past…”
SNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAKE!!! - ryanclassic.net
Yeah, he said he was really excited
Everyone does, but he sounded like he was genuinely excited.
by Peter Raaymakers on Mar 2, 2010 4:14 PM EST up reply actions
He and Cullen
‘I went from the bottom-feeders to a team that has played insanely well and needs a player more or less exactly like me to fit in with an already outstanding group with a Jack Adams’ potential winner behind the bench? Score!’
SNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAKE!!! - ryanclassic.net
I was worried the organization's reputation took a hit with the Heatley mess
Silver Seven - The Daniel Alfredsson of Ottawa Senators Blogs
That or every player in the NHL not named Joe Thornton and Patrick Marleau hate Heatley and think he's what the organization's problem was
SNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAKE!!! - ryanclassic.net
This sounds way more plausible
I’m going with this
Silver Seven - The Daniel Alfredsson of Ottawa Senators Blogs
Actually, yeah, I agree
… except I bet Marleau and Thornton don’t like him much off the ice, either.
by Peter Raaymakers on Mar 2, 2010 6:21 PM EST up reply actions
It makes a lot of sense to me.
The sign-and-swap Hossa for Heatley was Muckler’s doing. Ray Emery was an issue, and that was corrected. Heatley was a problem and he’s gone now, too. Minus the signing of Emery in the first place, Murray’s fixed a lot of Muckler’s errors. That puts a new shine on the organization, even if there are some problems and mistakes here and there.
Plus, all new players know they can take out any frustrations by firing pucks at Pascal Leclaire’s head and still win games.
SNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAKE!!! - ryanclassic.net
That’s like a bonus for me in this deal: Another reason to root against Heatley.
Lighthouse Hockey: Under contract through 2021, knees and hips be damned.
Ottawa always seems to work out deals with Atlanta, Carolina or the Islanders. I find it a bit funny that Sutton has been a Thrasher and an Fishstick.
It's weird, right?
I guess it could just be GMs who like working with one another.
by Peter Raaymakers on Mar 2, 2010 4:15 PM EST up reply actions
He's not on the official roster yet. No name, no number.
I know some teams are faster at putting them up than others, but Cullen’s name appeared really quickly after the trade. Within ten minutes of the Grebeshkov trade, Nashville had him with 37 on the roster.
SNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAKE!!! - ryanclassic.net
Agreed
Maybe he’ll fight Neil for it, though. I’d watch that.
Silver Seven - The Daniel Alfredsson of Ottawa Senators Blogs
Interesting subnote: there's a t-shirt for sale on the front of Ottawa's online store page with the current 2D unused logo
SNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAKE!!! - ryanclassic.net
You can also get a few neat jerseys
Luke Richardson’s #2 and your choice of J., D. or Z. Smith
SNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAKE!!! - ryanclassic.net
Okay
Actual store
I can’t find the shirt anywhere, but the graphic is there. So confusing.
SNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAKE!!! - ryanclassic.net
THAT'S THE WRONG LOGO
YOU’RE WORTHLESS
Silver Seven - The Daniel Alfredsson of Ottawa Senators Blogs
It's true, he did
Hey, Mark, ever heard of eBay?
by Peter Raaymakers on Mar 2, 2010 6:22 PM EST up reply actions
Hey, Peter, ever heard of shutting up?
Silver Seven - The Daniel Alfredsson of Ottawa Senators Blogs
You'll like Sutton
New York resident here … I watch the Islanders regularly. Sens gain, Islanders big loss. You’ll like what you see from Sutton on the ice and he’s a class guy.
I'm excited to see him play
I sure hope he fits in here!
by Peter Raaymakers on Mar 2, 2010 5:27 PM EST up reply actions
Heatley deal: The new Yashin deal?
Disgruntled Senator shipped out for underrated hulking defenseman (Chara), offensively minded forward (Spezza), and forward who plays himself out of the pros (Muckalt). Sound familiar?
Now here’s to hoping Heater lives up to the Yashin part of the deal by grossly underachieving and eventually getting banished to Siberia. And don’t forget, many analysts predicted he’d hit 60 goals, and at the very least 50 this year.. dude’s on pace for 40, and under 90 points. An off year by his standards. Ha!
Hahahaha... maybe, but not likely
Heatley’s not my favourite player to watch—he has never been too exciting, individually—but he’s more internally motivated than Yashin ever was. He may be off-pace this season, but I doubt he’ll fade away to the extent Yashin did.
Also… Chara > Sutton, as much as I hope Sutton works out.
by Peter Raaymakers on Mar 2, 2010 5:49 PM EST up reply actions
Spezza is better than Michalek, Chara better than Sutton, Heatley better than Yashin.
Not much of a comparison, in my opinion, but nice try, heh.
Silver Seven: the Daniel Alfredsson of Ottawa Senators blogs.
Yeah it was a stretch
Cheechoo is WAY better than Muckalt.
FACT: Cheechoo has more assists (9) and more points (14) than Muckalt had assists (8) and points (also 8)
SNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAKE!!! - ryanclassic.net
I think you're missing the telling stat
Number of music videos dedicated to you by creepy fat guys. Cheechoo 2, Muckalt…?
Are you really comparing Sutton to Chara!?
or even Michalek to Spezza?
by GelatinousMutantCoconut on Mar 2, 2010 8:34 PM EST up reply actions
It's actually pretty sad that that's all we got for Heatley .
And by extent, Hossa and Rachunek.
by GelatinousMutantCoconut on Mar 2, 2010 8:36 PM EST reply actions
That's taking a lot of trades and summing them up!
Rachunek for deVries
deVries and Hossa for Heatley
Heatley for Michalek, Cheechoo
Rachunek + Hossa for Michalek and Cheechoo
by Peter Raaymakers on Mar 2, 2010 8:39 PM EST up reply actions
WHY DIDN'T WE SCORE THERE
EVEN LUNDQVIST THOUGHT WE SHOULD HAVE
by Peter Raaymakers on Mar 2, 2010 8:39 PM EST reply actions
Wow... that was a reply fail
I was wondering where that comment went. I just wrote it off as a browser glitch.
by Peter Raaymakers on Mar 2, 2010 10:17 PM EST up reply actions
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